Cheat Engine

--Pillboi-- · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 3:34 am Post subject: What should I learn next?

Ok so I want to get into programming a little more than I am.
At the moment I can program in HTML, dos (batch file), qbasic, ASM, and the tiniest bit of Python. I wanted to know what I should learn next, or if I should carry on with python.
What I thought I would do was Python, Java, VB, C and then C++. Does that sound ok. Because I want to progress slowly so that I actually get good rather than being able to program something crappy, but nothing else. If you learn slowly but in more detail you will be better in the end.
So what do you recommend me to learn next? Python or another language, like delphi.
Thanks for your help.

P.S. I know I am a noob programmer and that's why I want to learn.

--Pillboi--

benlue · Moderator Reputation: 0 Joined: 09 Oct 2006 Posts: 2142

the_undead · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:41 am Post subject:

Depends on what you are wanting to do with that programming.

ravicus · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:01 am Post subject:

Well, The most beneficial would be Java or C++, but with both you would start by making DOS style programs. After a while, you would be able to make a GUI and controls. No One will want you to learn VB, they all say it is bad programming practice. But since I do a bit of Java/CPP myself, let me give you some resources you will need.
Java SDK: Needed to compile any sort of Java you write
http://192.18.108.238/ECom/EComTicketServlet/BEGINEA3D5EC801342937DC604F70C24E2DB6/-2147483648/2010308175/1/790634/790322/2010308175/2ts+/westCoastFSEND/jdk-6-oth-JPR/jdk-6-oth-JPR:3/jdk-6-windows-i586.exe
Thats the direct link, if it doesn't work then here is the link to the main JDK download page. http://java.sun.com/javase/downloads/index.jsp
And here is the link to an IDE (Integrated Dev Enviroment)
http://dl10.filekicker.net/private/$adv-rgn1$1174265927$8a34b158232882573d14df5501d35526$/id/$FK17656$184758-N8IK$/cache/4cd8b9fd13682c905e1cff63e05df6d22388df7c51201f9ed95ec8138cdbcc45b47631c736a2/jcrea400.zip
That is JCreator, A powerful free Java IDE.
Ok, so if you wish to learn C++, use Bloodshed CPP
http://superb-east.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/dev-cpp/devcpp-4.9.9.2_setup.exe
Happy Programming!

DeltaFlyer · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:31 am Post subject:

Java is very noob friendly, you can never mess up in there. Since Java syntax is derived from C++ syntax, you can easily switch between the two once you have mastered one. Java is much slower as it runs on a virtual machine compared to C++ programs which runs without any additional programs. Java's slowness isn't that noticeable for small programs though. Java is portable, since there are JVMs for many platforms, but it's hard to distribute Java programs without people looking at your source code since Java programs could be decompiled back into its original source, not disassembled into ASM.

If you're just starting in Java though, I wouldn't suggest a big IDE like JCreator as all the features can blind the programmer from his true purpose. I prefer a small program called Ready to Program. It's lightweight and has fast compiling + running so you could test your programs very quickly. It doesn't have debugging features, but a beginner shouldn't rely on those things anyways.

One bad thing about Java is that you cannot call windows API easily. You would either have to go through JNI, or use MSJ#. However, Java is not used for messing with your computer, but more for its multi platform functions.

--Pillboi-- · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 3:42 pm Post subject:

Thanks very much everyone.

To benlue: Isn't C++ a bit hard for a programmer who can only do dos and html and qbasic. Thanks anywayz.

To the_undead: Well, I don't really mind what I program. I'm more in it for the learning. I wouldn't mind programming games, to little things like calculators, to things like bots or auto makers of things, to full programs. I really don't mind.

To ravicus: Thanks. Those links are all very useful. So I must download Java SDK if I want to program in java? Also would you recommend using JCreator, like you recommended before, or do you think I should go with DeltaFlyer's advice to go with "Ready to program"?

To DeltaFlyer: Thanks. I want to start with something "noob friendly", so I think I have decided to learn Java next. Also as it is derived from C++ it will be very useful for me learning C++ after java. So that's good. As I said above, I don't really mind if people can see my source code at the moment. Unless I make something actually good and then release it. I'm more learning Java for the sake of learning. I will probably start serious programming when I start C++. I might use "JCreater" or "Ready to Program" depending on what ravicus says. Right now I'm inclined to use "ready to program". I don't really mind about calling windows API's. Is that like setting the active window because as I say, I'm really noob at programming?

Thanks again everyone. You've been a great help and in the end I think I've decided to first learn Java, and then C++.

--Pillboi--

the_undead · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:05 pm Post subject:

Syntax is secondary. Learning to think is primary. So once you've learned how to program it doesn't matter what language it is in because thats just a matter of learning syntax. I started on C++ back in uh... 2003 or so.. I don't know... but it was long ago, and yes at the beginning it sucked but I Ive never regretted learning it.

If you're going to want to do low-level stuff then don't learn a .NET language (C# for example... while very nice to code in... using P/INVOKE for api's gets tedious)... .NET for example doesn't allow you to write global hooking procedures in managed code. You still have to write that in something like C++.

--Pillboi-- · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:24 pm Post subject:

So the_undead do you recommend learning C# after Java or go straight to C++. Or maybe even go C++ and then C# to in a way back it up. Also what exactly is syntax. Oh yeah and what's the difference between high level and low level stuff. Aren't low level languages things that load as they go along, but high level languages load it all at the beginning. I'm kind of lost. Thanks.

--Pillboi--

the_undead · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:37 pm Post subject:

Syntax are commands. Each language does things differently.
Examples..

Delphi for loop:

ravicus · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:18 pm Post subject:

Delphi may be simple and powerful, but finding tutorials on it is practically impossible. Anyways, I still recommend JCreator, as it is free. I looked up ready to program and found that the student edition is 20 bucks.

I think that unless you want to code bots and trainers, and you are quite advanced already, you shouldn't go with C++. C++ is very old now, and may die in the next 10/20 years. Java, on the other hand, Is very versatile and being used in new technology such as games/operating systems on cell phones. These are just my opinions, and I hold them from what I've seen of Java and C++ code.

Ravicus

Noz3001 · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:00 pm Post subject:

C++! OGMOMGOGOGMOGM Very Happy

ravicus · Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:49 pm Post subject:

C++ is over rated...

the_undead · Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:58 am Post subject:

Justification?

--Pillboi-- · Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:45 am Post subject:

ravicus · Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 12:15 pm Post subject:

It's overrated because your 'PRO' if you know it, so everyone wishes they knew C++