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greatsage
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HackOtaku wrote:
So he was saying "We" meaning that himself and the Muslims will cast terror? Otherwise why not just say "Allah" will spread terror?


sorry no Smile

" you may be thinking this is from the perspective of Muslims or Muhammad, peace be upon him; i.e., that "We (Muslims) will cast terror into the hearts of those non-Muslims"; but this is an incorrect interpretation. "

"so it is not "We (Muslims) will cast terror". it is Allah promising something ... Allah is giving them reassurance that ALLAH will show them ... it is such individuals that will have terror cast into their hearts."

i could have been more concise

as to why not "just say Allah instead of We", there are numerous reasons. the majority of the qur'an is actually highly advanced and rhythmic poetry. so this would be one reason. the other reason would be, Allah simply chose to address Himself as "We" in the Qur'an. but not every time.


It would be pretty weird if you never said "I" but "justin/swattyboy/otaku" every time you referred to yourself

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To0k
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

greatsage wrote:
To0k wrote:
HackOtaku wrote:
Channel GannoK wrote:
There are no Muslim terrorists and they are quiet and peaceful alway, if you're delusional enough.


Teach me your ways talix


It's easy, any time a terrorist attack happens carried out by muslims, use the no true scotsman fallacy. Then you'll discover that it's not the fault of the tenants of Islam, but instead just some poor misinformed souls.
This, or just pick any spot on this bullshit bingo card and you're good to go.

being a retarded hatemonger that can't critically assess situations usually does involve mindlessly following memes, regurgitating stupid shit, and generally saying things you're clueless about.
so yeah, easy enough. but the informed are very aware of the reality, and only see pity for children who behave in such ways.

good luck in life when you are already handicapped by your inability to see your irrationality and absurdity; it is the punishment of this world & the punishment of the next will be even worse for you.

www.huffpost.com/entry/playing-the-taqiyya-card-evading-intelligent-debate_b_5906ecdbe4b084f59b49fabc

www.huffpost.com/entry/calling-isis-unislamic-is_b_6730702

literally only a troll or an uneducated retard could only ever apply this thinking. given that you clearly want to rationally assess and discuss some materials, but have made yourself incapable of doing so for others; your bias is clear (and so is your stupidity)

what else is clear? u are in the minority and this type of thinking is already a relic of the past, and in pathetic death throes
>u are in the minority and this type of thinking is already a relic of the past, and in pathetic death throes
>has trump as president

greatsage wrote:
so while my understanding is that you may be thinking this is from the perspective of Muslims or Muhammad, peace be upon him; i.e., that "We (Muslims) will cast terror into the hearts of those non-Muslims"; but this is an incorrect interpretation.

this is not the case or what the verse is establishing.
'You took that verse out of context', [ X ] check.

Are you even muslim btw? Of just pretending to be one? One can never be sure as you pretended to be some buffed, curly haired, macho guy for years, even though the reality was you being some tiny, fucked up kid who was getting beaten up by his dad. (religion of peace)
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greatsage
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It’s kinda weird to say that Muslims and etc wanna turn US into Saudi or Iran when Muslims often criticise both, and the US is already implementing white Christian shariah into the govt.
See: all of the recent legislation preventing abortion that shariah would be okay with

www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/actually-sharia-law-is-kinda-fine-with-first-trimester-abortion

I don’t see the point of that statement; it isn’t even true in practice since the Muslims in the US government work to uphold the constitution (which is integral to America)

Aren’t you just criticizing Muslims for having a political opinion at all, then? Aren’t you kinda just admitting that you have extreme prejudice against Muslims (consider Iran and Saudi are extremely dissimilar, especially politically, except in the deity they worship), especially since you offer no real criticism with the statement of an unfounded claim weaponized against Muslims specifically to silence them ?

what is the point of saying absolutely nothing except something about yourself, Kyle?

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HackOtaku
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

greatsage wrote:
HackOtaku wrote:
So he was saying "We" meaning that himself and the Muslims will cast terror? Otherwise why not just say "Allah" will spread terror?


sorry no Smile

" you may be thinking this is from the perspective of Muslims or Muhammad, peace be upon him; i.e., that "We (Muslims) will cast terror into the hearts of those non-Muslims"; but this is an incorrect interpretation. "

"so it is not "We (Muslims) will cast terror". it is Allah promising something ... Allah is giving them reassurance that ALLAH will show them ... it is such individuals that will have terror cast into their hearts."

i could have been more concise

as to why not "just say Allah instead of We", there are numerous reasons. the majority of the qur'an is actually highly advanced and rhythmic poetry. so this would be one reason. the other reason would be, Allah simply chose to address Himself as "We" in the Qur'an. but not every time.


It would be pretty weird if you never said "I" but "justin/swattyboy/otaku" every time you referred to yourself


Unless I mad habit of always talking in third person. Why would Allah talk in third person anyway? Makes more sense that Muhammad was talking in first and the "we" is him and the muslims while Allah is Allah. I know you believe he was just a "mouthpiece for God" or something like that, but I don't buy it.
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greatsage
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HackOtaku wrote:
greatsage wrote:
HackOtaku wrote:
So he was saying "We" meaning that himself and the Muslims will cast terror? Otherwise why not just say "Allah" will spread terror?


sorry no Smile

" you may be thinking this is from the perspective of Muslims or Muhammad, peace be upon him; i.e., that "We (Muslims) will cast terror into the hearts of those non-Muslims"; but this is an incorrect interpretation. "

"so it is not "We (Muslims) will cast terror". it is Allah promising something ... Allah is giving them reassurance that ALLAH will show them ... it is such individuals that will have terror cast into their hearts."

i could have been more concise

as to why not "just say Allah instead of We", there are numerous reasons. the majority of the qur'an is actually highly advanced and rhythmic poetry. so this would be one reason. the other reason would be, Allah simply chose to address Himself as "We" in the Qur'an. but not every time.


It would be pretty weird if you never said "I" but "justin/swattyboy/otaku" every time you referred to yourself


Unless I mad habit of always talking in third person. Why would Allah talk in third person anyway? Makes more sense that Muhammad was talking in first and the "we" is him and the muslims while Allah is Allah. I know you believe he was just a "mouthpiece for God" or something like that, but I don't buy it.


you'd do better to read the Qur'an to understand the concept more. Allah is not a person so while it may be strange for a person, it is beautiful in Arabic and the meaning is conveyed precisely and profoundly.

as for why I believe that, I did not just wake up and accept it without question. I fought and objected to it, and the objections I raised with the knowledge I gained were effectively answered and the complications I was facing were solved. in the end I was only left with a truth I could no longer fight and object to, but rather submit and embrace.

how did this occur? i studied multiple religions, and with islam the last religion i studied, i found it to be the most reasonable and rational, that i could logically conclude to be true. the basis of this reasoning was the Qur'an, which you can find all over, as well as tafsir and masjid frequenting (alongside church frequenting, and other places of worship for hindus, synagogues etc).

ive actually found a lot of revert stories that are similar to mine. ex might be abdulahad, a doctor of mathematics who set out to disprove the Qur'an as being scientifically and historically inaccurate, and inconsistent/illogical. ultimately he failed on what he set out to do, and instead accomplished verifying the Qur'an, and embraced islam.
there are numerous others that i could talk about, but i doubt you care since it would serve little purpose or point.

however, here is an article he has written that is pretty nice
https://www.whyislam.org/submission/the-holy-quran/the-amazing-quran-3/

simply though, "We" is a style of speaking just like when a king does it. there is plenty in the Qur'an where Allah speaks in the first person as well. but there is nothing Allah does without reason, yet not everything Allah does needs to be explained in full detail;

"when guidance comes to you from Me, whoever follows My guidance - there will be no fear concerning them, nor will they grieve."

the nuance is there for numerous reasons that become clear when reading the Qur'an, and when listening to the Arabic prose.

i know earlier you said that you are not very educated on islamic history, so I found these resources for you, if you would care for some quality entertainment that is also highly educational.

this is a tv series, Farouk Umar, based on the second caliph (successor of Muhammad, peace be upon him), Umar ibn Al-Khattab. it follows his life before islam, during the days before Islam and the early days of Islam as he and others opposed Islam, why he and others embraced islam, and how families and the Makkans reacted to their clansmen/children becoming Muslim, all the way to the hijrah to Madinah, and the death of Muhammad, peace be upon him. it continues into the caliphate of Umar

https://archive.org/download/UmarFarooqSeriesEpisode01


and this is a movie, that is highly critically acclaimed (on IMDB top 250), you might want two sittings or more for it. i've had atheist friends from CEF who have watched it, and they enjoyed it. i think one actually watched it several times (which was weird to me, an atheist really enjoying this, but still staying firm in their conviction of atheism? not saying an atheist can't enjoy this and stay firm, it's just odd to enjoy it that much and even consider it a favourite film)

the movie essentially starts and ends with the prophethood of Muhammad, peace be upon him. it's not as long as the tv series, but it's still pretty long (around 3 hours)

you might be able to pirate both, maybe even in better quality. at least the movie. i hope the archive links work decently.

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2ewzp3

to quote a famous scholar, on a phrase that made him come to Islam; "you can deny God, sure, out of arrogance. but you can not deny Muhammad, peace be upon him". because, atheists typically object, "how can you expect me to accept what i can not perceive and know is not obviously there", Muhammad peace be upon him is a miraculous account that you can intimately inform yourself of, and the miraculous document of the Qur'an that could not have come from him, peace be upon him.

i know you might not have the patience for these videos, but they are also some of what helped me with furthering my islamic education and answering the complications i was finding;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyDpQcjjEMA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjohe9LhMQo

they're very clear lectures that explain clearly the answer to the question:

One day in the desert, while meditating in a mountain cave, Muhammad was struck by a revelation that changed his life and the world. Terrified by the force of the experience, he began to recite words that came to him, words he said were from God. These messages would continue throughout the rest of his life. Unable to write them, he would repeat them to his growing band of followers until they became part of their collective memory. Slowly these revelations began to form the book we now know as the Qur'an (or Koran). While people were shocked by these claims, "they acquired credibility because of the very nature of the words spoken," says M. Cherif Bassiouni, professor of law at DePaul University.

How could an illiterate man make up language of such poetry and wisdom?

The new faith and ideas that Muhammad proclaimed as the Word of God, were a threat to the Meccan establishment. Muhammad's pronouncement that there was only one God, particularly threatened the very livelihood of the rich Meccans who profited from Mecca's role as Arabia's most popular pilgrimage center. Through years of harassment and deprivation, and trading sanctions imposed against his people, Muhammad continued to preach and share revelations with his followers, calling on them to worship one God, to destroy idols and to practice charity. As the community faced growing hostility, he began to encourage Muslims to move across the desert and settle in the oasis town of Yathrib, later called Medina. When word of an assassination plot reached him, Muhammad barely escaped death and managed to join the growing Islamic community in Medina.

How could a man, from being illiterate, become the most important author in terms of literary merits in the whole of Arabic literature? How could he the pronounce facts of a scientific nature that no other human being could have possibly known at that time, and all this, without once making the slightest error in his pronouncement on the subject?
(Dr. Maurice Bucaille).


The message of ISLAM is simple: There is nothing worthy of worship except GOD alone, and Muhammad, peace be upon him, is His messenger and servant.

with the gravity of such claims that Islam makes, do you not owe it to yourself to verify them -- especially if they are true and there is sufficient evidence for you to conclude it is the truth? have you considered what would be necessary for you to have that verified ? how do you know that it is not in something you have not read ?

if i pick up any object, to say with truthfulness and confidence, "this is not a pen", i have to at the very least know what a pen IS. if you object to something, why not know what you are objecting to so that your objection is at least somewhat valid?

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HackOtaku
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brevity is the soul of wit. I often times think your entire argument strategy is to build such a massive wall of text that no one wants to bother reading it and you can call them a cop out. But I honestly don't want to read all that so I won't bother.
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Channel GannoK
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HackOtaku wrote:
Brevity is the soul of wit. I often times think your entire argument strategy is to build such a massive wall of text that no one wants to bother reading it and you can call them a cop out. But I honestly don't want to read all that so I won't bother.

It absolutely is, because I've given him the same treatment, a word for word, sentence by sentence response in the past.

He then would reply the equivalence of "lol ur dumb"

There is no arguing with him, in his mind he is always right and will perform mental gymnastics, annoy you, and just outright lie to make himself feel and look better, to himself.

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btw, since im a leech i have to get a job, arent u a 4x leech by having 4?

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To0k
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Channel GannoK wrote:
HackOtaku wrote:
Brevity is the soul of wit. I often times think your entire argument strategy is to build such a massive wall of text that no one wants to bother reading it and you can call them a cop out. But I honestly don't want to read all that so I won't bother.

It absolutely is, because I've given him the same treatment, a word for word, sentence by sentence response in the past.

He then would reply the equivalence of "lol ur dumb"

There is no arguing with him, in his mind he is always right and will perform mental gymnastics, annoy you, and just outright lie to make himself feel and look better, to himself.
Thats what he has been doing here for over 10 years. He hasn't changed at all, unlike everyone else who has been here for a long time. Thats why I posted the quote below, which he obviously ignored because he got called out for the idiot that he was, and still is:
To0k wrote:
Are you even muslim btw? Of just pretending to be one? One can never be sure as you pretended to be some buffed, curly haired, macho guy for years, even though the reality was you being some tiny, fucked up kid who was getting beaten up by his dad. (religion of peace)

It's also pretty sad how he still cares so much, that he actually bothers to write such massive blocks of text to try to convince someone on a game hacking forum that we all joined when we were 12. I had a day at work where there was not much to do, and wanted to check out if the forum was still alive. Imagine my surprise when I found out that talix was still here, and still arguing with everyone. He was an annoying person back then, and he still is now. So it actually makes sense that he would revert to the most annoying religion there is.
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Channel GannoK
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To0k wrote:
Channel GannoK wrote:
HackOtaku wrote:
Brevity is the soul of wit. I often times think your entire argument strategy is to build such a massive wall of text that no one wants to bother reading it and you can call them a cop out. But I honestly don't want to read all that so I won't bother.

It absolutely is, because I've given him the same treatment, a word for word, sentence by sentence response in the past.

He then would reply the equivalence of "lol ur dumb"

There is no arguing with him, in his mind he is always right and will perform mental gymnastics, annoy you, and just outright lie to make himself feel and look better, to himself.
Thats what he has been doing here for over 10 years. He hasn't changed at all, unlike everyone else who has been here for a long time. Thats why I posted the quote below, which he obviously ignored because he got called out for the idiot that he was, and still is:
To0k wrote:
Are you even muslim btw? Of just pretending to be one? One can never be sure as you pretended to be some buffed, curly haired, macho guy for years, even though the reality was you being some tiny, fucked up kid who was getting beaten up by his dad. (religion of peace)

It's also pretty sad how he still cares so much, that he actually bothers to write such massive blocks of text to try to convince someone on a game hacking forum that we all joined when we were 12. I had a day at work where there was not much to do, and wanted to check out if the forum was still alive. Imagine my surprise when I found out that talix was still here, and still arguing with everyone. He was an annoying person back then, and he still is now. So it actually makes sense that he would revert to the most annoying religion there is.


I'd argue Jehovah's witnesses are more annoying, albeit non violent in their approach to conversion and influence.

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Brolock
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mfw u yall are rly arguing with talix over LALAH


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Channel GannoK
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PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If we are to go by faith and faith alone in this world, then every religion is true and has to exist within some framework of eachother, leading to one conclusion that no religion wants to talk about, or agree to being the truth, that their gods that they worship are all beneath the one true God.

This is the actual mindset of Islam. This is not the mindset of muslims perse, although they can adopt this belief because of Islam, but this is the true actual literal interpretation of Islam. It's in the Quran. They can believe their religions if they so choose, but they have to give lip service and pay up to Islam, for it is the superior religion.


Everything about this religion is subterfuge. It is an abrahamic religion born around the same time as Judaism and Christianity. It is no better, yet much worse than those same religions.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for sky daddy coming to save us all. I embrace it and welcome it, but there is literally nothing but bloodshed, lies, and fear associated with RELIGION and PEOPLE that obsess themselves with this idea of sky daddy. Supposedly that in this life, by being a practicing christian, muslim, jew etc MAKES YOU INVULNERABLE to doing bad things or being a bad person, because some words in a book said so, and enough people are dumb enough to believe an illusion, a magic trick that this is the literal word of sky daddy, and that if you chant, pray, and idolize God, all will be answered.

Religious people by their very nature, are religious because of something evil in their lives, whether that is themselves or their family, in my years of living on this planet, being across the world, seeing people of different faiths and backgrounds, whatever that fucking means to you.

If anything I would see talix more like a shinto worshiper, if he were smart enough to pass off as a genuinely good person that he so claims to be, but he made the mistake after swapping religions like clothing, and then attaching himself to one of the most psychopathic, abusive ideologies that exists, or has ever existed in the history of man, and has forever put him on my shitlist of psychopaths and potential serious criminal list. Same story with Indianguy lol.

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Some Retarded Muslim who crys ad hominem every chance he can get wrote:
btw, since im a leech i have to get a job, arent u a 4x leech by having 4?

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greatsage
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PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2019 4:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

video: Why do Muslims hate non-believers?
youtube.com/watch?v=M0bUlWXqz_4

@Kyle, i dont think you understand faith whatsoever, so no, your 'if going by faith then every religion is true', this is not just a statement every religious person would disagree with you on but understands is not the case. i suggest you figure out what you're saying and what faith is. literally all of your first paragraph is actual nonsense. i'm not saying this from a place of animosity towards you, i'm saying it because i'm embarrassed for whoever authored that mess.

"religious people are religious only because of something evil in their lives", this is not just untrue but it is philosophically a ridiculous statement.

see:
"supposedly being religious makes you invulnerable to doing bad deeds"

literally none of these religions teach this. you're fully demonstrating my point of you being ignorant and yet loud. do you ever want to present a logical argument, or are you just going to make ridiculous statements and then insult anyone who points out how nonsensical you're being ?

HackOtaku wrote:
Brevity is the soul of wit. I often times think your entire argument strategy is to build such a massive wall of text that no one wants to bother reading it and you can call them a cop out. But I honestly don't want to read all that so I won't bother.


your loss dude. i gave you shorter answers and you weren't satisfied with those because they didn't contain sufficient enough information for you.
provide enough and you don't wanna spend five minutes reading it. guess what: if you don't respect a topic enough to consider it, you don't belong giving word about it like you have given it any consideration. it becomes immediately obvious to someone who has, that you haven't.

it's clear that literally every opinion you have voiced about my religion has come from a source of disrespect and violent opposition & ostracisation of any recognition of truth or ascertainment of knowledge of the topic. i have no idea why you have such an inherent discrimination against something and against people, and yet you feel you have any place to claim any discrimination against others (saying we Muslims hate others)
you have repeatedly demonstrated a lack of knowledge, and an insistence on staying uninformed, just to regurgitate your antagonistic behaviour. it terrifies you to confront any reputable source or information on the topic because then it would force you to confront your error. the same way it terrifies a dog to leave their vomit and not consume it.

the reason why you assume that is my 'strategy' is because you have no capacity to relate beyond making incredulous and condescending assumptions. you can never initiate the process of education in an individual who refuses to admit their ignorance or shortcomings. it is no wonder you oppose a religion that requires this of the believer; acknowledging and searching for their shortcomings and faults, and seeking knowledge, and making a conscious effort to better themselves.

at least it's pretty clear that i gave you the courtesy of a respectful discussion, via a thoughtful and considerate reply, even if you didn't want to (or are unable to) give that courtesy back.

----------


Sal Lavallo visited EVERY country in the world by age 27. He shares his conversion to Islam story below:
https://www.allamericanmuslim.com/sal-lavallo.html

From day one, Islam promoted knowledge, research, critical thinking, and the sciences.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qaji7usYVw

This Is How I Was Forced To Accept Islam
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=576775682683229

https://www.reddit.com/r/islam/comments/ay1wgs/we_need_to_compile_an_antiislamophobia_master/

"The person who is seeking the truth, one evidence will be enough for him.
A person who is acting upon their desires, a thousand evidences will not be enough for him."
- Sheikh Al-Albani

"You must be gentle. Truly, gentleness is not found in anything except that it beautifies it, and it is not removed from anything except that it disgraces it."
"I urge you to treat women well." "The best of you are the best to your wives."
"None of you is a believer unless he loves for his brother what he loves for himself."
- Prophet Muḥammad ﷺ



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