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Uhr2842
How do I cheat?
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Joined: 14 Dec 2024
Posts: 2
Location: Texas, USA
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 Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2024 6:40 am Post subject: Unreal Engine Dev Looking For Cheats |
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Hey everyone, I'm a pretty hardcore Unreal Engine Developer. I focus primarily on online multiplayer games using Unreal's GAS and all their other fancy C++ things. I code all of my projects on my own, and I'm fine with it.
The reason I'm here is because I am nearly obsessed at this point with trying to find people who would be willing to try and cheat the games I make. I have no idea how cheating works or anything about it, but I think about anti cheat measures in every aspect of my code but have never had any real tests if any of it does anything...
What I wish for the most is for someone to be willing to work with me on my multiplayer projects, because I heavily focus on server-authoritative control of critical functions in the game, I use client side prediction with server verification and rollback in several of my systems which are essentially anti-cheats.
If no one is willing to work with me on as complex of a project as that, I would for sure still be interested in making a single player game. I can make any game we can think of, I promise you there is nothing we can come up with single player that is more complex than understanding how multiplayer even works in Unreal.
For an example, I implement RNG Style Stats into RPG gear in the most generic form, however the functions that roll the stats, and the data required to define what a stat even is in the first place is all only held on the server, and all data simply replicated back to clients. My real curiosity lies in the fact that I want to know if someone can still cheat my stuff using only all the Unreal Engine special engineered systems.
I just made this profile fresh so it won't let me post links yet, so I'm putting my YouTube below I'm currently making an Unreal 5 Multiplayer GAS RPG C++ Tutorial series and if you see episode #21 is the exact code what it looks like for those RNG Stats.
Please DM me, or contact me on YouTube @Uhr2842, I'm available on Discord @Uhrvr and on Patreon @Uhr2842. I'm not sure how often I will remember to check back to this website so I'm sorry if you DM me and I have a delayed response.
Thank you to anyone who took the time to read this.
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atom0s
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Joined: 25 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Mon Dec 16, 2024 3:05 am Post subject: |
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| Uhr2842 wrote: | Hey everyone, I'm a pretty hardcore Unreal Engine Developer. I focus primarily on online multiplayer games using Unreal's GAS and all their other fancy C++ things. I code all of my projects on my own, and I'm fine with it.
The reason I'm here is because I am nearly obsessed at this point with trying to find people who would be willing to try and cheat the games I make. I have no idea how cheating works or anything about it, but I think about anti cheat measures in every aspect of my code but have never had any real tests if any of it does anything...
What I wish for the most is for someone to be willing to work with me on my multiplayer projects, because I heavily focus on server-authoritative control of critical functions in the game, I use client side prediction with server verification and rollback in several of my systems which are essentially anti-cheats. |
Hello and welcome to the forum. Generally, we do not allow the discussion of online/multiplayer hacking on this site as it is against the rules. However, since you are the developer of the game directly, it may be something Dark Byte would allow on a case-by-case basis. (It is entirely up to him if he wants to allow it at all or not though.)
That being said, I would suggest approaching this with a few different kinds of setups and teams if you ideally want to get a more complete solution of testing. The level of testing you will get only by having people blindly attack your client/server is not going to match what can be done by also having other people with actual code access being able to do code audits and reviews.
| Uhr2842 wrote: | | For an example, I implement RNG Style Stats into RPG gear in the most generic form, however the functions that roll the stats, and the data required to define what a stat even is in the first place is all only held on the server, and all data simply replicated back to clients. |
While implementing the core feature of handling the item generation and stats generation on the server does prevent the normal and direct means of the client manipulating things, it does not stop the client from potentially taking control of parts of the code in other ways that can affect outcome. This is where having more eyes on the actual code and being able to audit it will have a higher impact on potentially finding bugs and other issues.
For example, lets say each player has their own seed and random number generation instance. Now lets assume you tied the seeding to the player in some manner such as when they first enter a zone, the RNG handling is re-seeded. This then allows the player to purposefully leave/enter a zone with the intention of attempting to control and manipulate the seed in some deterministic way. While this may seem improbable and highly unrealistic from happening (as in the player being able to determine this kind of setup exists and is happening) it has happened on existing MMOs. So in this instance, there is literally nothing the client/player is doing that is actually cheating and manipulating anything on their end, they are just abusing a flaw in the code on the server. This kind of issue would then simply come down to a lack of proper coding and code review.
This kind of situation can lead to an endless amount of ways to cheat on the game without doing anything to the actual client in terms of hacking or memory editing.
Another example of something that is common in online game hacking is the improper use of signed and unsigned values and the math around them. It is almost guaranteed that every MMO in existence is prone to a bug/exploit that involves this kind of bad code. This would then either abuse a flaw in your games UI system to make something happen that normally shouldn't or basic memory/packet editing to attempt to manipulate something in a manner that uses values in a manner that was not intended.
Another common means of hacking online games is through packet injection or manipulation. It is very common for online games to be prone to various exploits through packet injection as they rely too heavily on client sided conditional limitations/checks and assume that those safeguards are enough to stop unexpected traffic. It's possible you have a system coded in your game to have an exchange between the client and server that takes a specific amount of steps and packets back and forth, but that exchange could be manipulated in a manner that abuses different systems being used during that transmission causing unexpected side affects. This is a very common means of duping in a lot of online games where trading or usage of systems like vendors/auction houses are designed with a set flow of data and does not account for things happening out of order or with manipulated data.
| Uhr2842 wrote: | | My real curiosity lies in the fact that I want to know if someone can still cheat my stuff using only all the Unreal Engine special engineered systems. |
Due to the way Unreal Engine is designed from the core engine, it is extremely easy to hack in various ways. If you search around the web, you will find countless projects for dumping and generating information about games that make use of the various versions UE throughout the years. It is extremely easy to dump and generate an SDK for most UE games due to this. This can allow hackers to easily see all the various things you have personally coded and implemented on the client on top of what is already part of the engine itself.
While you may make and design things to be more restrictive through being server-authoritative, it does not stop cheating as a whole and in most cases just moves the goal post on what will be exploited/cheated in the long run. It also depends on how restrictive you design things. As an example, it is very common for most MMOs to have movement and speed handling done on the client due to the resource intensive nature of validations and enforcement of it on the large scale of every single player every single frame. Instead, things are implemented in a way that allows the client to tell the server where its at and how fast its moving while having the server simply doing basic sanity checks instead of save on resources. It's fairly easy for the server to detect cheating by tracking the players movement between 'ticks' and interpolating the data to detect invalid movement attempts. (ie. speed hacking, position warping, going out of bounds or through walls, etc.)
In some MMOs it's possible to hack movement speed to a certain amount before you trigger any kind of detection and either get kicked, banned or 'rubber-banded' backward to where the server is enforcing you to be. This kind of approach can also lead to other means of hacking as the server will want to be doing less per-tick calculations on every client. So for example, if your game has fall damage and you have the client handling movement with the server simply doing validation checks, then it is very common for the server to be in control of telling the server when fall damage happens. When that is the case, the client can be simply modded to never send that packet completely nulling any fall damage that would happen.
However, in the online hacking space, these kinds of cheats are not the main focus or money makers. Instead, it is more common that things like botting and custom overlays are the prime focus. Any kind of automation is a highly desired thing in online games to remove the manual repetitive tasks that the game may have. Automation and botting can be as simple as clicking 1-2 buttons automatically, such as to automatically use a health potion when the players health is getting low, to full-scale botting where a tool can fully automate the gameplay entirely. Additionally, tooling to have custom overlays (think WoW addons but for a game that does not support them natively) is also a high value target of interest for cheating. Things that overlay additional 'hidden' data that is otherwise not given to the player but can be determined through packets or other memory information is extremely useful. For example, if your game has pvp, having a radar/map that shows where every other player is all the time can be a huge advantage to someone.
There's countless other means of hacking a game that goes beyond the basic infinite health, infinite gold, etc.
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Uhr2842
How do I cheat?
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Joined: 14 Dec 2024
Posts: 2
Location: Texas, USA
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| Posted: Mon Dec 16, 2024 3:23 pm Post subject: |
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Thank you so much for the response. I've met an experienced cheater and a novice person who wants to learn. The current plan is that I will be making an AWS hosted dedicated server build with not much taken in consideration for anti cheats. We will let it be for a while and anyone is welcome to try and exploit. I will post a repo with the exact C++ code I write everything in, but not the server or network code. I will post known exploits if people wanting to learn know they have a target to build for because others have done it. I will patch and add more security measures and repost a second version and see what is mitigated and what is still exploitable and repeat the process. The third and final iteration will be my active project where I aim for all anti cheat measures to the best of my capabilities and attempt to make a very difficult game to exploit.
I've invited a few people to my Discord along with the fellow developers who are doing my tutorial series making miltiplayer RPGs and I hope we can make something cool out of this. The first version of this project should be online within a few days.
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